6

I sometimes see people write something along the lines of ni faras ambaŭ X kaj Y. This seems like it might be a direct translation of the English construction we do both X and Y as a way to emphasise the conjunction. To me it would seem more natural to write this as ni faras kaj X kaj Y.

Is the first way also acceptable?

7

Yes, I think that is an anglicism in the form you put it. I found this quote in PIV:

«La konj-an uzon de ambaŭ en la frazo ni loĝas en Londono ambaŭ en somero k en vintro mi trovas tute ne aprobinda» skribis Z.; oni diru: ‘‘kiel en somero, tiel en vintro,«ne nur… sed ankaŭ…».

The reason I find it strange to use ambaŭ as well is that it need not necessarily be about just two things. For instance:

Kaj ilia amo, kaj ilia malamo, kaj ilia ĵaluzo jam de longe malaperis.

PMEG

On the other hand, there is an almost identical construction with pretty much the same meaning that is definitely grammatical:

pli bone estas iri senfila en la ĉielon, ol se ambaŭ, la patro k la filo, iras en la inferon

PIV

Here la patro kaj la filo is an appositive to ambaŭ, i.e., it is a specification. This is not equivalent to the form you examplified, because you can apply the kaj … kaj construction to the appositive:

(…) ol se ambaŭ, kaj la patro kaj la filo, iras en la inferon.

Yet you cannot apply the kaj … kaj construction to an already existing kaj … kaj construction.

2
  • I totally agree with your explanation. I also checked the use of ambaŭ in recent newspaper articles and could not find a structure like in English 'both ... and', they still follow the traditional style as noted in PAG. Of course an apposition like in ol se ambaŭ, la patro k la filo, iras en la inferon historically was the base of the English structure, but Esperanto has just not gone the way of English here (yet). Mar 2 '18 at 11:19
  • Indeed, I think the only acceptable form for this is kaj … kaj (and the appositional one). I think it is a better form, because it is generalizable to more than two instances. Interesting that the English form indeed comes from the apposition; I only realized that this may be the case while writing the answer! Mar 2 '18 at 12:05

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.